7:8 - Imhotep vs. Freddy Krueger

[UMPIRE]

SEASON 7, ROUND 8

Imhotep

Slot: The Team's Dark Secret
Season Wins: 3
Season Losses: 0
Fantasy Team Page
Read more about Imhotep at Wikipedia
Official Site: Universal Studios

Freddy Krueger

Slot: The Team's Dark Secret
Season Wins: 0
Season Losses: 0
Fantasy Team Page
Read more about Freddy Krueger at Wikipedia
Official Site: New Line Cinema

Battle Terrain
Target: Mystery Inc.

[Movie-Brat]

I think Freddy can take this. Like, the gang would have to sleep separately and they wouldn't know Freddy is targeting them. 

Separate the group, target one by one and prey on their fears. 

[C.T.]

Imhotep wouldn’t have to wait for them to sleep...

[Movie-Brat]

Daydreaming is also a thing however as the first and fourth film demonstrates. 

Besides, Imhotep got outsmarted twice in his movies. He's likely to be outsmarted by a talking dog. 

[Magnamax]

Imhotep wasn't outsmarted in either movie. The second one basically had a "whoops, this random thing steals your powers and makes you into a normal man," trap that is specifically designed for him. The first one just had Eevee using a specific incantation in a specific location in order to de-power him. 

 

Freddy Krueger may be able to take out the gang, but he's going to have to wait for them to sleep and, correct me if I'm wrong, go into their individual dreams and kill them one at a time. Imhotep can just wipe them out at once without an issue. I think he has a much faster and more efficient win here than Freddy. 

[Movie-Brat]

4 minutes ago, Magnamax said:

Imhotep wasn't outsmarted in either movie. The second one basically had a "whoops, this random thing steals your powers and makes you into a normal man," trap that is specifically designed for him. The first one just had Eevee using a specific incantation in a specific location in order to de-power him. 

 

 

Well yes, what's stopping Velma from knowing both stuff? Third movie literally had Evee write books about it. Not her first rodeo with ancient Egypt anyway considering she was playing an undead mummy. 

[Magnamax]

Just now, Movie-Brat said:

Well yes, what's stopping Velma from knowing both stuff? Third movie literally had Evee write books about it. 

Velma has no evidence of prior knowledge on Egyptology and Evee has not written books in Velma's universe so that Velma would have read them when the match starts. There's no reason Velma would know anything about him heading into the fight. Again, Imhotep is powerful enough that he should win before Freddy has a chance to wait for them to sleep. I don't think the gang has any time to get any knowledge on Imhotep before he can win.

[Movie-Brat]

We have to consider Scooby and Shaggy having dumb luck defeating either villain though and Imhotep may get the worst of it. 

[Magnamax]

18 minutes ago, Movie-Brat said:

We have to consider Scooby and Shaggy having dumb luck defeating either villain though and Imhotep may get the worst of it. 

Fair on Scooby and Shaggy having dumb luck. But I don’t think there’s any reason to think that Imhotep would get the worst of it.

Going off track records, Freddy is more likely to get outdone by a regular group of people, as he is beaten by teenagers and Imhotep is only beaten through incredibly specific circumstances and specific people equipped to fight him. Again, I just think Freddy would take too long and has a better chance of being beaten by the gang. Imhotep has too many large advantages.

[Movie-Brat]

I mean, Scooby and Shaggy took down magical beings and mad men before. No reason to think Imhotep wouldn't be any different. 

Besides, second Mummy movie had a child sidekick who played a part screwing him over. 

[Boratz]

Looking at both of their powers and track records; Imhotep would seem like a better chance of defeating them. As pointed out, Freddy has been defeated before by teenagers and what not. While it is definitely not easy to defeat Freddy, he has been pulled from dream world to real world multiple times and defeated in the real world. 

Imhotep took some doing. Evie had to have knowledge of Egyptian and turn him mortal. Even then he was shown to be a pretty talented warrior in facing off against Rick. Perhaps Velma has some knowledge of Egyptian reading but I just don't see them being able transcribe it correctly and in the time to stop him from wiping them off the map

[Magnamax]

1 minute ago, Movie-Brat said:

I mean, Scooby and Shaggy took down magical beings and mad men before. No reason to think Imhotep wouldn't be any different. 

Besides, second Mummy movie had a child sidekick who played a part screwing him over. 

there’s reason to think Imhotep is different because he is far more powerful than what they’ve faced on a regular basis. Scooby and Shaggy are not going to bungle into some way of defeating him. I think it’s at best tenuous to think Scooby and Shaggy’s luck factor is going to decide this. 

The child had no part in Imhotep getting defeated. He only had the bracelet giving hints where the scorpion king was. Again, without the deus ex machina causing Imhotep to become de powered, then he would have “won” that movie.

 

 

[Movie-Brat]

He still brought his mother back from the dead though. 

[Macklemore]

Yeah, I think pure dumb luck might edge them out when it comes to Freddy. I can definitely see Shaggy/Scooby being left last and winning it for Mystery Inc. after being reminded that it's a dream, at which point they abuse the fact that they're a dream and defeat him within said dream. Imhotep doesn't really have a weakness that's evident immediately, and he just drown them all in sand as soon as he wants to.

[Movie-Brat]

Though they do have a tendency to survive. Cartoon physics and all. The only time the Scooby gang were in legit danger was that Supernatural crossover. 

[Magnamax]

3 hours ago, Movie-Brat said:

He still brought his mother back from the dead though. 

Correct, though it has no bearing on the outcome of this fight. The kid didn’t outsmart Imhotep and had nothing to do with his demise.

22 minutes ago, Movie-Brat said:

Though they do have a tendency to survive. Cartoon physics and all. The only time the Scooby gang were in legit danger was that Supernatural crossover. 

Yes, though Imhotep still presents a bigger threat than Krueger. They still would affect Krueger more, as I agree with Macklemore’s assessment.

[Movie-Brat]

1 hour ago, Magnamax said:

Correct, though it has no bearing on the outcome of this fight. The kid didn’t outsmart Imhotep and had nothing to do with his demise.

Yes, though Imhotep still presents a bigger threat than Krueger. They still would affect Krueger more, as I agree with Macklemore’s assessment.

Freddy can at least mess with reality, even in dreams so he could make the Scooby gsng vulnerable and more prone to actual physics. 

Like the Scooby gang survived cat people and zombies. 

[Bergy_Berg]

Mystery Inc really has no chance against Freddy. If you try to pull off his mask in a dream you'll get an ass full of knives.

[Pizzaguy2995]

The one thing working against Imhotep in this matchup will be his tendency to underestimate his opponents. In both Mummy movies he constantly missed chances to fully eliminate Rick and the gang because he didn’t see them as too big of threats to him. Now he did have his henchwomen kill Evie (temporarily) in the second movie, but didn’t try to kill off Rick afterwards despite knowing that Rick beat him once and that attacking him while he was distraught over Evie’s death would have been his best chance. Because of that I see Imhotep also underestimating the Scooby gang as well, and the problem with that is that Velma (as of Scooby Doo Where’s My Mummy) is now a ancient Egyptian expert and will likely figure out a way to defeat Imhotep if he toys with them too much.

Now at first I thought Freddy being beaten by teenagers in the past would be his weakness, but now I realize it is a strength! Because Freddy has been beaten by teenagers in the past he’ll know better then to underestimate the Scooby gang and will go for the killing blow quicker then Imhotep would. Also when Freddy kills main characters (Nancy, Kristen) they stay dead! 

Edited February 9, 2021 by Pizzaguy2995
Mistakes

[Magnamax]

4 hours ago, Pizzaguy2995 said:

The one thing working against Imhotep in this matchup will be his tendency to underestimate his opponents. In both Mummy movies he constantly missed chances to fully eliminate Rick and the gang because he didn’t see them as too big of threats to him. Now he did have his henchwomen kill Evie (temporarily) in the second movie, but didn’t try to kill off Rick afterwards despite knowing that Rick beat him once and that attacking him while he was distraught over Evie’s death would have been his best chance. Because of that I see Imhotep also underestimating the Scooby gang as well, and the problem with that is that Velma (as of Scooby Doo Where’s My Mummy) is now a ancient Egyptian expert and will likely figure out a way to defeat Imhotep if he toys with them too much.

Now at first I thought Freddy being beaten by teenagers in the past would be his weakness, but now I realize it is a strength! Because Freddy has been beaten by teenagers in the past he’ll know better then to underestimate the Scooby gang and will go for the killing blow quicker then Imhotep would. Also when Freddy kills main characters (Nancy, Kristen) they stay dead! 

Your logic doesn’t work when you claim Imhotep has underestimated people in the past, so he’ll do it again but Freddy has done the same, but he will not do that again. We’ve seen Imhotep target and take out people before, without any plot armor he certainly would eliminate the gang quickly. 

Doing a quick scan, it looks like Velma was helping with one excavation and helped set up a ruse involving a mummy. That still doesn’t give any reason as to why she can figure out Imhotep. 

I keep pointing this out, but Imhotep has no reason to take out the O’Connell’s in The Mummy Returns. His group has the only way to make him mortal with the book, so all he wants to do is get to the scorpion king first. It’s a literal random act by gods that takes his powers away. I don’t think he underestimates, so much as he has a clear goal in both movies that doesn’t directly involve the protagonists.
 

Freddy still needs to go into the dreams of at least five different people, while they’re asleep. Imhotep just had to walk up and take them out in a sand blur. 

[Boratz]

3 hours ago, Magnamax said:

Your logic doesn’t work when you claim Imhotep has underestimated people in the past, so he’ll do it again but Freddy has done the same, but he will not do that again. We’ve seen Imhotep target and take out people before, without any plot armor he certainly would eliminate the gang quickly. 

Doing a quick scan, it looks like Velma was helping with one excavation and helped set up a ruse involving a mummy. That still doesn’t give any reason as to why she can figure out Imhotep. 

I keep pointing this out, but Imhotep has no reason to take out the O’Connell’s in The Mummy Returns. His group has the only way to make him mortal with the book, so all he wants to do is get to the scorpion king first. It’s a literal random act by gods that takes his powers away. I don’t think he underestimates, so much as he has a clear goal in both movies that doesn’t directly involve the protagonists.
 

Freddy still needs to go into the dreams of at least five different people, while they’re asleep. Imhotep just had to walk up and take them out in a sand blur. 

I agree with this completely. 

Imhotep never outright targeted the O'Connell's either. In the first film, he went after Evie, succeeded in capturing her and his goal was to use her to resurrect his long lost love (he failed in that). That was also after the fact of him targeting the American group, in which he was pretty successful in.

2nd movie - as you said, his goal was the Scorpion King. He could have cared less about the O'Connell's. They only came into play near the very end. Even then in his mortal form, he was able to put up a fight against Rick. It wasn't until the horrible CGI Scorpion King came into play which interrupted their battle.

If underestimating is what is being argued then Freddy has underestimated his potential victims in all of his movies. I agree with you in that it is not a valid point saying that Imhotep underestimated the O'Connells and therefore would underestimated the Mystery Inc gang, but for some reason Freddy who has underestimated high school teenagers time and time again would miraculously overcome that and defeat the Mystery Inc. 

[Pizzaguy2995]

4 hours ago, Magnamax said:

Your logic doesn’t work when you claim Imhotep has underestimated people in the past, so he’ll do it again but Freddy has done the same, but he will not do that again. We’ve seen Imhotep target and take out people before, without any plot armor he certainly would eliminate the gang quickly. 

Doing a quick scan, it looks like Velma was helping with one excavation and helped set up a ruse involving a mummy. That still doesn’t give any reason as to why she can figure out Imhotep. 

I keep pointing this out, but Imhotep has no reason to take out the O’Connell’s in The Mummy Returns. His group has the only way to make him mortal with the book, so all he wants to do is get to the scorpion king first. It’s a literal random act by gods that takes his powers away. I don’t think he underestimates, so much as he has a clear goal in both movies that doesn’t directly involve the protagonists.
 

Freddy still needs to go into the dreams of at least five different people, while they’re asleep. Imhotep just had to walk up and take them out in a sand blur. 

No reason to take out the O’Connells? How about the fact that they were the ones who killed him in the last freaking movie? How about the fact that Rick literally had a tattoo on his arm that meant he was destined to fight evil like Imhotep? How about the fact that he kidnapped their son and knew very well that they were going to come after him?
 

Are none of those reasons to destroy the O’Connells immediately? And if not then why the heck would he be in a hurry to kill the Scooby gang? If was comfortable spending two/thirds of a movie dicking around with a guy who killed him in the last movie, then why wouldn’t he do the same with some random teenagers. Heck, the guy was stupid enough to mistake Evelyn for his love reincarnated (she was actually the Pharaoh’s daughter reincarnated) even though the second film revealed that the two looked nothing alike. Whose to say he won’t make the same mistake with Daphne or Velma and give the rest of the gang time to regroup and plan while he’s too busy trying to make her his wife?

 

Yes Freddy has underestimated his victims before but the difference between him and Imhotep is that once Freddy realizes your a threat he stops messing around. In the third film when he has the chance to kill off his old enemy Nancy, he doesn’t fucking hesitate. He doesn’t leave her crying over her dead loved one like Imhotep did with Rick, he straight up kills her off for real! In the fourth film the first thing he does is kill off the three teens who took him out in the last movie, the only real threats to him. No hesitation, no dicking around with them for half a movie just boom, boom, boom! All three dead as a doorknob, no messing around.
 

My main point is Freddy at least learns from his past mistakes, he’s shown the ability to realize he’s underestimated his opponents before and when given a second chance he does go out of his way to eliminate those who have beaten him before. Because of that it is reasonable to argue that he’ll take the Scooby gang more seriously then Imhotep will because he’s been kill off by them before and will actively try to kill them as quickly as he can. Imhotep didn’t even take his archenemy Rick seriously enough to kill him as soon as he got the chance, so why should I think he’ll have have a different mindset with a bunch of teenagers and their talking dog?

 

 

[Magnamax]

5 hours ago, Pizzaguy2995 said:

No reason to take out the O’Connells? How about the fact that they were the ones who killed him in the last freaking movie? How about the fact that Rick literally had a tattoo on his arm that meant he was destined to fight evil like Imhotep? How about the fact that he kidnapped their son and knew very well that they were going to come after him?
 

Are none of those reasons to destroy the O’Connells immediately? And if not then why the heck would he be in a hurry to kill the Scooby gang? If was comfortable spending two/thirds of a movie dicking around with a guy who killed him in the last movie, then why wouldn’t he do the same with some random teenagers. Heck, the guy was stupid enough to mistake Evelyn for his love reincarnated (she was actually the Pharaoh’s daughter reincarnated) even though the second film revealed that the two looked nothing alike. Whose to say he won’t make the same mistake with Daphne or Velma and give the rest of the gang time to regroup and plan while he’s too busy trying to make her his wife?

 

Yes Freddy has underestimated his victims before but the difference between him and Imhotep is that once Freddy realizes your a threat he stops messing around. In the third film when he has the chance to kill off his old enemy Nancy, he doesn’t fucking hesitate. He doesn’t leave her crying over her dead loved one like Imhotep did with Rick, he straight up kills her off for real! In the fourth film the first thing he does is kill off the three teens who took him out in the last movie, the only real threats to him. No hesitation, no dicking around with them for half a movie just boom, boom, boom! All three dead as a doorknob, no messing around.
 

My main point is Freddy at least learns from his past mistakes, he’s shown the ability to realize he’s underestimated his opponents before and when given a second chance he does go out of his way to eliminate those who have beaten him before. Because of that it is reasonable to argue that he’ll take the Scooby gang more seriously then Imhotep will because he’s been kill off by them before and will actively try to kill them as quickly as he can. Imhotep didn’t even take his archenemy Rick seriously enough to kill him as soon as he got the chance, so why should I think he’ll have have a different mindset with a bunch of teenagers and their talking dog?

 

 

Those might be decent reason on their own, but he was on a ticking clock to get to the scorpion king by a certain time. I don’t remember the exact time, but they arrived basically the day of, if he wasted any time then the scorpion king window would have closed. There’s no reason for him to slow down for the O’Connell’s when he rules everything by taking out the Scorpion King. Worth pointing out again that he succeeded and got to the scorpion king first and would have been able to win, had the gods not taken away his powers and there wasn’t a random scorpion king killing scepter in play. 
 

This is all to say, Imhotep doesn’t really “dick around,” he moves clearly and deliberately towards his goal. His goal was never a o take out Rick, but he was under a clock to do something else. The times he needs to eliminate a group, he does it quickly, this, for example, seems very direct and no messing around:

 

Also, you may say Freddy learns from his mistakes, but he keeps getting beaten by teenagers that he needs to come back in order to ultimately defeat. I’d say that leaves more room for the mystery gang to give him trouble this time. 
 

It’s also worth noting that there is nothing the Scooby gang is doing to give Imhotep trouble. He can show up and take them out quickly, see above, Freddy still has to wait for them to be asleep, then go in one at a time. 

[Movie-Brat]

To be fair, those guys were disposable flunkies with no plot armor. 

[Boratz]

Imhotep also carries with him the plagues of Egypt, power over some of the elements, telekinesis and strength. Not to mention invulnerability to mortal weapons. He doesn't have to wait until they are asleep. If the Mystery Inc Gang is his target, they would be wiped off the face of the Earth. 

I mean I could see Scooby-Doo and Shaggy trying to chow down on a mile high sandwich and drinking who knows what before they realize that there food is covered in locusts and drinks filled with blood.