11:2 - Raphael (TMNT) vs. Cassandra Cain

[UMPIRE]

SEASON 11, ROUND 2

Raphael (TMNT)

Slot: The Team's Ninja
Season Wins: 0
Season Losses: 0
Fantasy Team Page
Read more about Raphael (TMNT) at this Wiki
Official Site: Mirage Studios

Cassandra Cain

Slot: The Team's Ninja
Season Wins: 0
Season Losses: 0
Fantasy Team Page
Read more about Cassandra Cain at this Wiki
Official Site: D.C Comics

Battle Terrain
Ninja Challenge: MMA Fight!

[RakaiThwei]

Question... Are MMA rules implemented in this fight?

Cause if MMA rules are implemented... Here they are.

https://www.ufc.com/unified-rules-mixed-martial-arts

[Peypeypeypey]

I favor Cain here. She's one of the best fighters in DC and has beaten people I would consider superior to Raphael with relative ease, such as Nightwing

[C.T.]

Oh yeah, gotta go with Cain in this particular bout. As said, she's one of the greatest fighters among that universe and she can pick up fighting styles on the fly pretty much.

[Gizmo Hibiki]

Cassandra may be skilled, but I think Raphael's physiology and training will help him in the long run. Considering he's got a hide and shell that protects him from lasers and his training giving him control over his breathing, I think he has this in the bag. Granted I'm sure Cassandra has training similar to Raph's, but because of how tough his mutated body is, I think it can help him get the win.

[C.T.]

3 minutes ago, Gizmo Hibiki said:

Cassandra may be skilled, but I think Raphael's physiology and training will help him in the long run. Considering he's got a hide and shell that protects him from lasers and his training giving him control over his breathing, I think he has this in the bag. Granted I'm sure Cassandra has training similar to Raph's, but because of how tough his mutated body is, I think it can help him get the win.

Raph's built tough, that much is true, but Cass has fought and beat people just as tough if not tougher. She also has control over her breathing so I'm not sure what the point of mentioning that is, and in addition to her skill, she's also deceptively strong. She's able to break through quartz windows(quartz ranking a 7 or 8 on the Mohs hardness scale, which for reference has diamond at 10 on that scale): https://imgur.com/a/1ryrI

As well as shatter swords with her hand: https://imgur.com/2HhePuV?r

[RakaiThwei]

Assuming that this is the 2003 version of Raphael, this version is perhaps one of the more powerful versions of the character based on the fact that he's had to deal with more than just street thugs and the usual Foot ninja, but also a range of extraterrestrials, supernatural entities, interdimensional counterparts, and of course a Demon version of the Shredder alongside with his brothers.

Cassandra is definitely skilled, there is no question about that but I would think that Raphael's physiology would pose some problems for her. While his build is mostly humanoid, I cannot say that pressure points and maybe some parts of the anatomy match up with that of a human being's. It's a safe bet that his pressure points aren't even in the same place as a human's for that matter. And of course there's the shell..

To my understanding and research, an empty Turtle's shell can withstand up to 200x it's own weight in force before cracking and it also is dependent on the size and weight of the Turtle in question. In real life, we have seen Turtles withstand the crushing bite force of an alligator with no damage to minor scratches, although this also depends on the size of the Alligator in question (some have been seen to crush Turtle shells, but those Alligators have been shown to be quite large too).

Looking at Raphael 2003's stats on the TMNT wiki.. He weighs in at 180 lbs. So let's do some math here.

So 180 x 200 = 36,000 PSI.

That's a pretty hefty amount of pressure to get Raphael's shell to crack and break, We're looking at 16 ton-force just to break through that shell.

I would think that Raphael's unusual anatomy would help him here and allow him to get some surprises on Cassandra. I mean, she's strong because of her training but I don't think  she would be able to generate something to break through that shell.

[C.T.]

She doesn't need to crack the shell though, was mostly pointing that out just to clarify her striking strength when she does land her blows, which in this case I think is fairly often. I really wouldn't count on the turtle's anatomy helping him here. He's not that much different from like, Killer Croc or Orca, etc. His pressure points and such might be different but he's still humanoid in shape standing upright and Cassandra's body reading ability is world class. She'd be able to anticipate his moves easily enough, as I see it. Her ability in reading individuals in combat gives her what might as well be actual precognition. That, on top of her world class skills, I don't see him being able to land many blows, I'd daresay he'd be hard pressed to land any blows, even. 

That, and the more she eludes him/lands counterstrikes of her own, the more pissed Raph might get and he just gets sloppier as his temper runs wild. 

I'd give it to Cass 8 or 9 times out of 10. Raph's skilled and tough, nobody can deny that but I don't think he brings anything to the table that Cass hasn't seen before. 

[Peypeypeypey]

1 hour ago, RakaiThwei said:

Assuming that this is the 2003 version of Raphael, this version is perhaps one of the more powerful versions of the character based on the fact that he's had to deal with more than just street thugs and the usual Foot ninja, but also a range of extraterrestrials, supernatural entities, interdimensional counterparts, and of course a Demon version of the Shredder alongside with his brothers.

Cassandra is definitely skilled, there is no question about that but I would think that Raphael's physiology would pose some problems for her. While his build is mostly humanoid, I cannot say that pressure points and maybe some parts of the anatomy match up with that of a human being's. It's a safe bet that his pressure points aren't even in the same place as a human's for that matter. And of course there's the shell..

To my understanding and research, an empty Turtle's shell can withstand up to 200x it's own weight in force before cracking and it also is dependent on the size and weight of the Turtle in question. In real life, we have seen Turtles withstand the crushing bite force of an alligator with no damage to minor scratches, although this also depends on the size of the Alligator in question (some have been seen to crush Turtle shells, but those Alligators have been shown to be quite large too).

Looking at Raphael 2003's stats on the TMNT wiki.. He weighs in at 180 lbs. So let's do some math here.

So 180 x 200 = 36,000 PSI.

That's a pretty hefty amount of pressure to get Raphael's shell to crack and break, We're looking at 16 ton-force just to break through that shell.

I would think that Raphael's unusual anatomy would help him here and allow him to get some surprises on Cassandra. I mean, she's strong because of her training but I don't think  she would be able to generate something to break through that shell.

That's a pretty flawed way to calc how durable the turtles are because it assumes that the turtle's shells scale linearly and infinitely. There's a theoretical cap to how durable a shell can be. For example, sea turtles weigh hundreds of pounds more than Raph, but their shells are broken by Sharks with a bite force of 4,000 PSI. 

This whole point is moot though, and you know it is. The turtles lose fights all the time just by being knocked around too much. They lose many fights without anyone ever breaking their shell, because of course they do. Cass can just batter him around when he does come out of his shell, and if he doesn't, he would be counted for timidity for sure, which is against the rules.

This whole discussion is completely moot though, because Raph of all the turtles isn't going to be hiding in his shell. He's a hot head who's going to throw the first punch for sure and won't be spending time hiding in his shell

[Pizzaguy2995]

Keep in mind guys if this is a MMA sponsored fight Cassandra won’t be allowed to bring any of her weapons or gadgets into the octagon. I know some of y’all are bringing up her being able to beat Killer Croc and Orca, but how many of those fights would she have won if she fought with just her fists in an enclosed space? Raphael has taken down plenty of tough opponents like Shredder, Hun, Master Khan, Bishop, and the Foot Elite! But his main advantage will be the fact that in enclosed spaces like the Octagon the bigger, heavier fighter usually beats the smaller one. Why do you think UFC fighters are divided based on weight classes?

[C.T.]

17 minutes ago, Pizzaguy2995 said:

Keep in mind guys if this is a MMA sponsored fight Cassandra won’t be allowed to bring any of her weapons or gadgets into the octagon. I know some of y’all are bringing up her being able to beat Killer Croc and Orca, but how many of those fights would she have won if she fought with just her fists in an enclosed space? Raphael has taken down plenty of tough opponents like Shredder, Hun, Master Khan, Bishop, and the Foot Elite! But his main advantage will be the fact that in enclosed spaces like the Octagon the bigger, heavier fighter usually beats the smaller one. Why do you think UFC fighters are divided based on weight classes?

Mh, yeah, that's the thing. Cassandra hardly ever uses gadgets beyond like, a grapple gun and that's just for getting around from place to place. Like 95% of her fights she just uses fists. Once in a blue moon she'll use like a sword or something but as a member of the Bat family she's the one who uses tools the absolute least. So...yeah. Her victory record with just fists is pretty solid. And yeah, that's true in reality but with Cass, there's not a doubt in my mind she'd be the exception to that rule. 

[Peypeypeypey]

9 minutes ago, Pizzaguy2995 said:

Keep in mind guys if this is a MMA sponsored fight Cassandra won’t be allowed to bring any of her weapons or gadgets into the octagon. I know some of y’all are bringing up her being able to beat Killer Croc and Orca, but how many of those fights would she have won if she fought with just her fists in an enclosed space? Raphael has taken down plenty of tough opponents like Shredder, Hun, Master Khan, Bishop, and the Foot Elite! But his main advantage will be the fact that in enclosed spaces like the Octagon the bigger, heavier fighter usually beats the smaller one. Why do you think UFC fighters are divided based on weight classes?

Cass really doesn't need weapons to beat incredibly strong fighters. She has stalemated Deathstroke. Twice. The only weapons she used in those fights were the ones Deathstroke pulled on her. She also beat Lady Shiva unambiguously without weapons. Twice. She can find the pressure points of and one shot both a Shapeshifter and a giant alien monster that was tossing around Superboy. Without weapons, of course, in both instances. Her punches are strong enough to damage a superhuman who was so durable, bullets crumpled against his skin. Here she knocked out another superhuman. She's also undoubtedly much faster. This page implies that she's a bullet timer, or at least moving at comparable speeds to a bullet. Here she casually dodges point blank bullets. Same thing here. She knocks out six guys in the time it takes for a bottle to hit the ground. She moves like a blur, knocking people off their feet as she runs past them. Also, UFC fighters are based on weight classes IRL because the bigger you are, the stronger you are, generally, but in real life no one can move anywhere near as fast as Cass, and honestly, Cass is probably stronger than Raph. Here she is breaking through three inch quartz windows. Here she shatters a gravestone with a kick. And again, she visibly hurt a metahuman who was able to shake off bullets. Cass has much better physicals and a much better fight record than Raph. Hell, just stalemating Deathstroke was probably enough for me to be convinced she would win this fight  

[RakaiThwei]

25 minutes ago, Peypeypeypey said:

That's a pretty flawed way to calc how durable the turtles are because it assumes that the turtle's shells scale linearly and infinitely. There's a theoretical cap to how durable a shell can be. For example, sea turtles weigh hundreds of pounds more than Raph, but their shells are broken by Sharks with a bite force of 4,000 PSI.

I'm going by the numbers which I have come across from my research.

https://urbanfishkeeping.com/how-strong-is-a-turtle-shell/

https://www.turtleholic.com/how-hard-is-a-turtle-shell/

Also Sea Turtles shells are softer than freshwater Turtles and tortoises because they are built differently and it has to bend the pressure of the ocean which they are adapted to. So really saying that Raphael's shell isn't durable compared to a larger Sea Turtle is kind of wrong because we're looking at different structures and adaptations of two different species of Turtles. Not every Turtle species is going to have the same level of shell strength, I mean there's even soft shells species out there who have no protection compared to their hard shell cousins.

 

[Peypeypeypey]

9 minutes ago, RakaiThwei said:

I'm going by the numbers which I have come across from my research.

https://urbanfishkeeping.com/how-strong-is-a-turtle-shell/

https://www.turtleholic.com/how-hard-is-a-turtle-shell/

Also Sea Turtles shells are softer than freshwater Turtles and tortoises because they are built differently and it has to bend the pressure of the ocean which they are adapted to. So really saying that Raphael's shell isn't durable compared to a larger Sea Turtle is kind of wrong because we're looking at different structures and adaptations of two different species of Turtles. Not every Turtle species is going to have the same level of shell strength, I mean there's even soft shells species out there who have no protection compared to their hard shell cousins.

 

Fair enough, but my entire point was that the actual numbers are entirely pointless because Raph isn't going to be hiding in his shell, and Cass would definitely not need to break through it

[RakaiThwei]

1 minute ago, Peypeypeypey said:

Fair enough, but my entire point was that the actual numbers are entirely pointless because Raph isn't going to be hiding in his shell, and Cass would definitely not need to break through it

I know he isn't. I'm just mentioning it because the shell is a part of his body and is a durability factor in there.

But I will say this as a TMNT fan, I haven't watched too much of the 2003 cartoon where as my expertise on TMNT comes from the original 1984 Mirage comics and the current IDW comics-- so really, I don't have much of a leg to stand on here and the 2003 version of Raphael is one of the more interesting versions as he's had a fluctuating power scale. But he always returns to his permanent base level which is common in most forms of TMNT (Rise being excluded since that series is off the wall).

I don't know too much about the 2003 version of Raphael outside of the fact that initially, he followed his Mirage counterpart up until somewhere around the middle of season one of the show. Outside of the acquired weapons and Chi Powers which he had-- I'm not too familiar with his level of pain threshold but from what I do know is that the 2003 Raphael definitely played more on his hot-headedness... If anything, I would say he's worse than most incarnations out there, including being more of a hot-head than Mirage Raphael, who's definitely mellowed out as that version learned to reign in his anger.

[Pizzaguy2995]

20 hours ago, Peypeypeypey said:

Cass really doesn't need weapons to beat incredibly strong fighters. She has stalemated Deathstroke. Twice. The only weapons she used in those fights were the ones Deathstroke pulled on her. She also beat Lady Shiva unambiguously without weapons. Twice. She can find the pressure points of and one shot both a Shapeshifter and a giant alien monster that was tossing around Superboy. Without weapons, of course, in both instances. Her punches are strong enough to damage a superhuman who was so durable, bullets crumpled against his skin. Here she knocked out another superhuman. She's also undoubtedly much faster. This page implies that she's a bullet timer, or at least moving at comparable speeds to a bullet. Here she casually dodges point blank bullets. Same thing here. She knocks out six guys in the time it takes for a bottle to hit the ground. She moves like a blur, knocking people off their feet as she runs past them. Also, UFC fighters are based on weight classes IRL because the bigger you are, the stronger you are, generally, but in real life no one can move anywhere near as fast as Cass, and honestly, Cass is probably stronger than Raph. Here she is breaking through three inch quartz windows. Here she shatters a gravestone with a kick. And again, she visibly hurt a metahuman who was able to shake off bullets. Cass has much better physicals and a much better fight record than Raph. Hell, just stalemating Deathstroke was probably enough for me to be convinced she would win this fight  

I looked up the Deathstroke fights, the first one she ran away the second Slade started getting serious and in the second one it was revealed that Slade was just playing with her and leading her to his daughter Ravager. So I don’t really count those as “stalemating” him.

Now I’ll give you the Shiva feat, but that “alien tossing around Superboy” feat was very misleading. He wasn’t physically tossing around SB, he was just a telepath who managed to take over his powers. Nice try but please stop it with the misleading feats.

And no, Cassandra is not stronger or faster then Raphae btw. Raphael broke through a brick wall with a running start and with Leo squatted up a huge stone pillar:

He’s also dodged missiles, lasers, and point blank machine gun fire:

 

He’s also defeated just as many world class martial artists and fighters as Batgirl such as again Shredder, Hun, Master Khan, Bishop, and the Foot Elite! Of them at least Shredder and Khan have demonstrated pressure point attacks just as good as Batgirl’s and Raphael beat them regardless! Raphael already got every advantage, the limited spacing in the Octagon only further adds to it.

[Pizzaguy2995]

20 hours ago, C.T. said:

Mh, yeah, that's the thing. Cassandra hardly ever uses gadgets beyond like, a grapple gun and that's just for getting around from place to place. Like 95% of her fights she just uses fists. Once in a blue moon she'll use like a sword or something but as a member of the Bat family she's the one who uses tools the absolute least. So...yeah. Her victory record with just fists is pretty solid. And yeah, that's true in reality but with Cass, there's not a doubt in my mind she'd be the exception to that rule. 

Yeah but if her opponent is equally as skilled in martial arts, which Raphael has proven himself to be, then we must consider the advantages that an environment like the Octagon could provide. Like the fact that it’s enclosed nature would hinder someone like Cassandra who would need to move around a lot more then the heavier and stronger Raphael.

[RakaiThwei]

Good animated gifs showing some feats of Raphael there, Pizza! I commend you for it!

[C.T.]

44 minutes ago, Pizzaguy2995 said:

Yeah but if her opponent is equally as skilled in martial arts, which Raphael has proven himself to be, then we must consider the advantages that an environment like the Octagon could provide. Like the fact that it’s enclosed nature would hinder someone like Cassandra who would need to move around a lot more then the heavier and stronger Raphael.

Gotta full on disagree with you there, man. Raphael's good, no doubt but I don't think he's ever proven himself nearly as skilled as Cass. Not nearly. Sorry, but practically the whole Bat family are incredible, world class martial artists, and all of them concede that Cass is the best, by a wide wide margin. She has mastered new techniques after only seeing them in action once, and she seemed so accomplished at fighting with escrima sticks that Barbara Gordon assumed she'd been training with them for years and years. Turns out nope, she became a master with them training with Batman. A training session that only took five minutes, as Batman explained here: https://imgur.com/Y27DQdj

Or that time she fought dozens upon dozens of highly accomplished assassins: https://imgur.com/a/jYkFw and then even after all that, she turned around and kicked her mom Lady Shiva's ass too:

 

 

Raph is good.

Cass is better. 

[Peypeypeypey]

46 minutes ago, Pizzaguy2995 said:

I looked up the Deathstroke fights, the first one she ran away the second Slade started getting serious and in the second one it was revealed that Slade was just playing with her and leading her to his daughter Ravager. So I don’t really count those as “stalemating” him.

Now I’ll give you the Shiva feat, but that “alien tossing around Superboy” feat was very misleading. He wasn’t physically tossing around SB, he was just a telepath who managed to take over his powers. Nice try but please stop it with the misleading feats.

And no, Cassandra is not stronger or faster then Raphae btw. Raphael broke through a brick wall with a running start and with Leo squatted up a huge stone pillar:

He’s also dodged missiles, lasers, and point blank machine gun fire:

 

He’s also defeated just as many world class martial artists and fighters as Batgirl such as again Shredder, Hun, Master Khan, Bishop, and the Foot Elite! Of them at least Shredder and Khan have demonstrated pressure point attacks just as good as Batgirl’s and Raphael beat them regardless! Raphael already got every advantage, the limited spacing in the Octagon only further adds to it.

The important part of the Superboy feat wasn't even the strength of the creature itself, it was the fact that she can use pressure points to subdue giant alien monsters that are entirely non-human, so she could do the same to Raph. Maybe "stalemating" was a bit of an exaggeration, it has been a while since I've  reread the feats in full context, but the Batman and Lady Shiva feats still stand, and they are both far more skilled than anyone Raph has ever taken. Honestly, has Raph ever even defeated Shredder on his own? Like, in this continuity or in any other? I think Cass soloing both Batman and Lady Shiva is more than enough evidence that she's far more skilled than Raph is alone, not to mention the fact that not having weapons is definitely a bigger detriment to Raph than it is to Cass. Cass very rarely uses anything other than like a grappling hook, whereas Raph much more often uses his weapons in a fight. Lady Shiva is considered probably the best fighter in DC in terms of pure martial arts skill, and Cass has beaten her with no weapons twice. By contrast, in that TMNT/Batman crossover, Batman tossed around all 4 Turtles at once, and Shiva is superior to Batman in terms of pure martial arts skill, which this scenario is a test of. Now I know that TMNT/Batman crossover isn't canon to this version of Raph, I'm not trying to say that proves definitely that Cass would win, but almost everyone seems to agree that Batman is superior to the Turtles in one-on-one combat, and Cass is superior to Batman, so I think she should definitely win this one. Granted, this isn't my fight so I might not respond after this, but it's clear to me that Cass is the superior fighter in terms of skill and I don't think it's very close  

[C.T.]

1 hour ago, Pizzaguy2995 said:

I looked up the Deathstroke fights, the first one she ran away the second Slade started getting serious and in the second one it was revealed that Slade was just playing with her and leading her to his daughter Ravager. So I don’t really count those as “stalemating” him.

Now I’ll give you the Shiva feat, but that “alien tossing around Superboy” feat was very misleading. He wasn’t physically tossing around SB, he was just a telepath who managed to take over his powers. Nice try but please stop it with the misleading feats.

And no, Cassandra is not stronger or faster then Raphae btw. Raphael broke through a brick wall with a running start and with Leo squatted up a huge stone pillar:

He’s also dodged missiles, lasers, and point blank machine gun fire:

 

He’s also defeated just as many world class martial artists and fighters as Batgirl such as again Shredder, Hun, Master Khan, Bishop, and the Foot Elite! Of them at least Shredder and Khan have demonstrated pressure point attacks just as good as Batgirl’s and Raphael beat them regardless! Raphael already got every advantage, the limited spacing in the Octagon only further adds to it.

I'm sorry, did you just use breaking through a brick wall as proof he's stronger when I've shown that Cass has broken through a quartz window, a mineral proven to be nearly as tough as diamond, and when Cass breaks stuff like brick and concrete on the regular? Cass is also just as fast, dodging bullets on the regular, even after they have already been fired! She does so here:

Avoiding a sniper shot inches from her ear

And here: 

Casually avoiding multiple shots with a smile

Hell, she's so badass she can be stabbed in the heart or close to it and still get up and keep fighting with the blade still lodged in her chest.

 

[Pizzaguy2995]

28 minutes ago, C.T. said:

Gotta full on disagree with you there, man. Raphael's good, no doubt but I don't think he's ever proven himself nearly as skilled as Cass. Not nearly. Sorry, but practically the whole Bat family are incredible, world class martial artists, and all of them concede that Cass is the best, by a wide wide margin. She has mastered new techniques after only seeing them in action once, and she seemed so accomplished at fighting with escrima sticks that Barbara Gordon assumed she'd been training with them for years and years. Turns out nope, she became a master with them training with Batman. A training session that only took five minutes, as Batman explained here: https://imgur.com/Y27DQdj

Or that time she fought dozens upon dozens of highly accomplished assassins: https://imgur.com/a/jYkFw and then even after all that, she turned around and kicked her mom Lady Shiva's ass too:

Again Raphael has taken on just as many trained assassins as Cass. Or do you not believe that Shredder, Hun, Master Khan, Bishop, and the Foot Clan/Foot Elite belong in the same class as the Bat Family or Lady Shiva?

And Raphael in every incarnation is widely considered to at least be one of the two best martial artists in the TMNT setting. Only Leo could be better then him, and in some cases he’s portrayed as being better or at least physically stronger.

So yes he has in fact proven himself to be just as good a martial artist as Cassandra, the only difference is that Raphy is much stronger and heavier then her, and in a setting like the Octagon those two stats matter more then anything else.

[C.T.]

Just now, Pizzaguy2995 said:

Again Raphael has taken on just as many trained assassins as Cass. Or do you not believe that Shredder, Hun, Master Khan, Bishop, and the Foot Clan/Foot Elite belong in the same class as the Bat Family or Lady Shiva?

And Raphael in every incarnation widely considered at least one of the two best martial artists in the TMNT setting. Only Leo could be better then him, and in some cases he’s portrayed as being better or at least physically stronger.

So yes he has in fact proven himself to be just as good a martial artist as Cassandra, the only difference is that Raphy is much stronger and heavier then her, and in a setting like the Octagon those two stats matter more then anything else.

They might be, with the exception of most of the Foot Clan, but it doesn't really matter. Cass has been proven far more capable, both through action and others describing her(in fact it's been self admitted by Nightwing that he doesn't think he, Jason Todd, Tim Drake and Damian Wayne could beat Cass in a 4 vs 1 if she's going all out) so even if they are in the same class as the Bat Fam or Shiva which is a dubious claim to me, it wouldn't even matter because Cass is on a level above them.

So no, Raph has not proven himself to be just as good. Not in the slightest. 

[Pizzaguy2995]

14 minutes ago, C.T. said:

I'm sorry, did you just use breaking through a brick wall as proof he's stronger when I've shown that Cass has broken through a quartz window, a mineral proven to be nearly as tough as diamond, and when Cass breaks stuff like brick and concrete on the regular? Cass is also just as fast, dodging bullets on the regular, even after they have already been fired! She does so here:

No that was meant to be better then the shattering the gravestone feat. The lifting of the giant stone pillar was meant to be the best feat, as even if Raphy was only carrying half the weight that’s still a much better physical showing then anything Cassandra has done.

 

17 minutes ago, C.T. said:

Cass is also just as fast, dodging bullets on the regular, even after they have already been fired! She does so here:

Avoiding a sniper shot inches from her ear

And here: 

Casually avoiding multiple shots with a smile

Hell, she's so badass she can be stabbed in the heart or close to it and still get up and keep fighting with the blade still lodged in her chest.

Must I remind you of the speed feats of Raphael? 

Missiles and Lasers> Sniper shots dude.

[C.T.]

1 minute ago, Pizzaguy2995 said:

Missiles and Lasers> Sniper shots dude.

This is wrong on so many levels I'm just not going to bother.